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Subject: SPACE Digest V13 #581

SPACE Digest                                     Volume 13 : Issue 581

Today's Topics:
          Re: SPACE STATION FREEDOM WOUNDED
           Fred cut, AXAF and SIRTF funded
             Re: Space Station Cancelled
           Fred vs. Exploration and Science
       Re: Progress? (was: Re: Ethics of Terraforming)
           STUDENT GROUPS USF,INC. UPDATE 8
        United Space Federation, Inc. Update 8

Administrivia:

    Submissions to the SPACE Digest/sci.space should be mailed to
  [e-mail].  Other mail, esp. [un]subscription requests,
  should be sent to [e-mail], or, if urgent, to
             [e-mail]

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 17 May 91 03:58:08 GMT
From: ogicse!sequent!muncher.sequent.com![e-mail]
Subject: Re: SPACE STATION FREEDOM WOUNDED

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Matthew DeLuca) writes:

>If the two exerpted lines above aren't the biggest load of sh*t I've seen
>in months, I don't know what is.
>
>We have more asteroid chunks on earth than we know what to do with...
> we'veanalyzed hundreds and hundreds of them over the years,

Talk about a load of sh*t.

The funding for asteroid sample analysis has been less than
1/10 of 1% -- one-one-thousanth -- of what NASA has spent on
the Shuttle and, if it were not for the hard work of intelligent
explorers like James Van Allen and lobbyists like Jim Bowery, would
waste on Fred.  Due to the lack of care and attention on these
issues by so-called space supporters like yourself, we remain woefully
ignorant about basic questions regarding these resources.

We have a tremendous amount still to be learned about these fragments.
I notice you missed my list of outstanding problems of interest to
future space development, so here they are again -- now this time
sit down and _think_ about them, OK?  Here are three biggies (there
are many others as well):

* The supply and distribtion of water in earth-crossing objects.

* The frequency of, origin of, and earth-crossing asteroid(s) source
  of urelite diamonds.

* The existence of nickel-iron regolith.

A greatly expanded study of samples, and collection of new samples,
along with the other suggested missions you deleted -- visual survey
and infrared telescope probes -- can greatly illuminate or resolve
these problems.


--
Nick Szabo                [e-mail]
"If you understand something the first time you see it, you probably
knew it already.  The more bewildered you are, the more successful
the mission was." -- Ed Stone, Voyager space explorer

------------------------------

Date: 17 May 91 04:08:52 GMT
From: ogicse!sequent!muncher.sequent.com![e-mail]
Subject: Fred cut, AXAF and SIRTF funded

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Fraering Philip) writes:

>I don't think Freedom's a good idea, but let's face facts:

>1. It will probably have its budget restored by the Senate.

We need to work hard to prevent this.

>2. Killing Freedom will not transfer its money to space science.

That is _exactly_ what Congress did: it cut all funding for Fred,
and gave full funding to SIRTF and AXAF.

The Luddites have a real myth going here about poltical necessity
of astronauts.  Polls have always shown that citizens are every
bit as enamoured with real exploration as they are with astronaut
stunts. Now, Congress has demostrated that astronauts and their
groupies are _not_ politically important to the space program.
Space exploration no longer needs to be beholden to the centrally
planned, wasteful projects that astronaut fans have forced on
the program.  This week, two major exploration efforts were funded
because a collosal pork barrel was cut.  A happy week indeed!


--
Nick Szabo                [e-mail]
"If you understand something the first time you see it, you probably
knew it already.  The more bewildered you are, the more successful
the mission was." -- Ed Stone, Voyager space explorer

------------------------------

Date: 17 May 91 03:06:40 GMT
From: swrinde!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!usc!jarthur!nntp-server.caltech.edu![e-mail]  (David Palmer)
Subject: Re: Space Station Cancelled

[e-mail] (Henry Spencer) writes:

>Not to mention Galileo overruns.  Anyone want to bet on the effects when
>CRAF and Cassini run over?  And EOS is enough to give one the shivers.

Actually CRAF/Cassini is funded by an arrangement in which Cassini
overruns get taken out of CRAF.  Which is why they are often
mentioned in the same breath.

At least, that's the current plan.

--
        David Palmer
        [e-mail]
        ...rutgers!cit-vax!gap.cco.caltech.edu!palmer
    "Operator, get me the number for 911"  --Homer Simpson

------------------------------

Date: 17 May 91 04:58:48 GMT
From: ogicse!sequent!muncher.sequent.com![e-mail]
Subject: Fred vs. Exploration and Science


Excerpts from news wire post in sci.physics.  Note my ^^^^^
emphasis.  Not only has space exploration been victorious, but
the important science-advancing efforts of NSF have been enhanced as
well.

The myth that astronauts are politically necessary for space
funding has finally been put to rest.


<from Dow-Jones news service... without permission>

Subject: House Panels Vote To Kill 1992 Funds For Space Station
Date: Thu, 16 May 91 10:45:08 -0400 (EDT)


  WASHINGTON -- House Appropriations subcommittees voted to kill fiscal
1992 funding for the space station and trim President Bush's request for
the superconducting supercollider almost 19%.

  The more than $2 billion savings from the costly station would be
      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
redistributed to help finance increases elsewhere in space programs and
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
the National Science Foundation, as well as an expanded $6.6 billion
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
budget for the Environmental Protection Agency.

  The National Science Foundation would receive an estimated $2.7
billion, including $1.96 billion for research activities or nearly 16%
more than the current fiscal year ending Sept. 30. Within the $13.65
billion allocated to the National Aeronautics and Space Administration,
lawmakers approved the administration's full requests for the ambitious
Earth Observing System satellite program and AXAF X-ray telescope.

.....



--
Nick Szabo                [e-mail]
"If you understand something the first time you see it, you probably
knew it already.  The more bewildered you are, the more successful
the mission was." -- Ed Stone, Voyager space explorer

------------------------------

Date: 17 May 91 01:08:56 GMT
From: swrinde!cs.utexas.edu!sun-barr!ccut!wnoc-tyo-news!astemgw!kuis!rins![e-mail]  (will)
Subject: Re: Progress? (was: Re: Ethics of Terraforming)

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Frank Crary) writes:
>What is in the long term interests
>of mankind in NOT the same as doing what will cause people the least
>discomfort today.
>

    Perhaps the Japanese can offer something here.  Acually the Japanese are
    very good at thinking about their future.  When Admiral Perry came to
    Japan over 100 years ago the Japanese at that time realized that it
    was best to think about the future than to fight America.  They did'nt
    think about 5, 10, 50 years into the future.  These quys where thinking
    in terms of generations and hundreds of years.  And as a result of this
    thinking are now a World class economic power.

    Just to quote Mr. Morita of Sony: "U.S. managers are often criticized
    for their short-term outlook, supposedly forced on them by Wall Street".
    (Morita recalls a chat with a money trader in New York) "I enquired how
    far ahead he looks, One week?, "No, No" came the reply. "Ten minutes."
    was the answer. If Americans think only in terms of 10 minute action,
    while we Japanese think in 10-year terms, America assuredly faces
    gradual decline".

    Respectivly, if mankind (as a hole, not just America) does not change
    it way of thinking about the future, then all of the grand plans of
    inhabiting our solar system or what-ever will also face disaster.

    By the way, the Japanese are changing.  I was surprised by one of my
    students that ask me to listen to an Joke about America.  Here is how
    it went:
        What is the difference between England and the Philippines?
        nothing.
        What is the difference between America and the Philippines?
        The number of whores.

    I personally did'nt share his enthusiasm of this being funny.  So I
    asked him where he heard this and his friend a Kyoto Univ. had told
    him of it.  Talking about America in decline.  The Japanese seem to
    think so.


                            Will.....

------------------------------

Date: 17 May 91 02:58:55 GMT
From: vax5.cit.cornell.edu![e-mail]
Subject: STUDENT GROUPS USF,INC. UPDATE 8

************************************************************
* United Space Federation, Inc. posting for May 16th 1991  *
************************************************************
*An International(Multinational) Civil Space Agency by 1993*
************************************************************

   HOW TO START A UNITED SPACE FEDERATION STUDENT GROUP

1) YOU MUST FIND 5 OTHER STUDENTS WHO WILL HELP YOU
     START THE GROUP.

2) YOU MUST FIND A PROFESSOR WHO WILL BE YOUR GROUP
    ADVISOR.

3) YOU MUST FORWARD THE NAMES OF THE STUDENTS AND
    YOUR ADVISOR TO THE USF HEADQUARTERS.

4) YOU MUST REGISTER YOUR GROUP ON CAMPUS AND SEND
     THAT INFORMATION TO USF HEADQUARTERS TO BE
     VERIFIED.

5) YOUR GROUP MUST PAY A $100 FEE FOR YOUR START UP
     COSTS FOR YOUR OPERATIONS MANUAL AND OTHER ITEMS
     YOUR GROUP NEEDS TO BE OFFICIAL.

6) AFTER THE GROUP IS REGISTERED AS A STUDENT GROUP
    ON YOUR CAMPUS YOU MUST SEND PROF OF Registration TO
    USF HEADQUARTERS TO BE KEPT ON FILE.

7) WHEN YOUR GROUP HAS BEEN VERIFIED AS A REGISTERED
    STUDENT GROUP AND HAS PAID THE $100 STARTUP FEE.
    YOUR OPERATIONS MANUAL WILL BE SENT TO YOU AND
    YOUR GROUP,  WELCOME ABOARD!

     YOU AND YOUR GROUP AND OTHERS LIKE IT ALL AROUND
THE WORLD WILL BE A VERY IMPORTANT PART TO THE SUCCESS
 OF THE USF.

                                        GOODLUCK AND GODSPEED!
                                        Rick R. Dobson
                                        Executive Director
                                        United Space Federation,Inc.

Address:    UNITED SPACE FEDERATION, INC.
             International headquarters
                 P.O. Box 4722
            Ithaca, New York  14852-4722
           In the United States of America

------------------------------

Date: 17 May 91 05:42:34 GMT
From: vax5.cit.cornell.edu![e-mail]
Subject: United Space Federation, Inc. Update 8

******************************************************
*UNITED SPACE FEDERATION,INC. UPDATE 16th of MAY 1991*
******************************************************
                COMMENTS FROM THE FOUNDER

         WHY IS A WORLD SPACE ORGANIZATION NEEDED ?!?

In 1986 I had a very strong dream, or vision if you may!,
about the creation of an international civil space agency
( a United Space Federation ).  Since 1986 I have pursued my
vision with much critixizim and ridicule,  But all I have
envisioned is coming into being at quite a rapid rate.  First,
I must state three important insights that give urgency to
my efforts :


One -  Companies, Industries and Economies that where
created and supported by the now crumbling era of war
economies, are coming apart at the seams.  This is creating
large amounts of unemployed and HUNGRY! people around the
world.   A new  type of economy is needed to replace this
old form; or industrial and technological nations will have
no choice but to create new and imaginary threats, to
satisfy their hunger and need to expand.  What better way to
do this than move technology and industry away from the
finite resources of earth to the infinite realm of space.
There by utilizing this vast new resource, that could create
an unlimited potential for new and thriving economies for
the world.  This would replace or at least offer a viable
alternative to the now faltering war economies, with what
we might call a peace economy, that all countries could be
involved in and benefit from greatly.  Space stations, moon
bases, missions to mars, bases on mars and an infinite of
other possibilities would fill the gap that in the past was
dominated by military build ups. If a peace economy through
utilization and exploration of this new frontier of space is
not realized, the only alternative is a war.


Secondly - The growth and affects of technological
civilizations is damaging our planets environment.  This is
threatening our existence along with every other living
thing on the planet.  Our world is a closed ecological
system, so industry and other technological projects cause
harm to that closed system because they are inside it.
Environmentalist are not going to succeed in stopping this
damage to the environment unless they stop the cause, that
is humankind reverts to cave dwelling or living under trees.
The other alternative and the most logical one ,is to remove
many of these afflicting causes out side the closed
ecological system of the Earth.  This would consist of
moving industry and many other damaging environmental
technologies, and any future industrial activities, in to
space.  The first reply by finite earth bound thinkers is to
say, why pollute space!!  The fact of the matter is earth is a
closed ecological system, which is now under great strain
by technological civilizations.  If you think humankind will
give up their curiosity and drive to expand their minds and
surroundings and live in caves, this would not only be
absurd but a very nieve thought indeed.  Earth is finite were
as space is infinite, so by moving many these harmful
technological projects into space, where they would have
little if no impact on its infinite vastness; would to me,
seem to be the most practical goal for future expansion and
continuation of industrial activities, for which present and
future civilizations are, and will be, greatly dependent on
for there survival.

Thirdly - We as a human existence on this planet are now
faced with either adapting or perishing.  One of those
decisions is that if nations of the world are going to
coexist with each other peacefully into the future.  There is
going to have to be some endeavor which unites the
ambitions and desires of these nations for peaceful,
constructive and meaningful cooperative activities.  I am by
no means preaching would peace tomorrow or
demiliterization in any way.  For as long as humans have
emotions and differences, there will be military's and no
matter how small or unnoticible they may be there will be
wars.  I am saying that the bright  and ambitious minds of
the world need to reach out, if not for reasons of peaceful
challenges, it will be for destruction and war.

         So at present humanity is faced with a decision of
great magnitude.  This will not and should not be decided by
any one government or nation, but as an over all consensus
of survival by our world as a whole.  It is time for the child
of humanity to leave the womb of mother Earth, into the
new and vast domain among the stars.  For if we stay much
longer both mother and child may perish.


So in closing it is my hope that  a United Space Federation (
an international civil space agency ) may offer a solutions to the
present troubles of our world today, by providing a clear and
path for humanity far into the future.  This is my vision, and
my dream is to see it realized within my life time.

                     Thank you for your time and support, Godspeed!
                                                 Sincerely,
                                                 Rick R. Dobson
                                                 Executive Director
                                                 United Space Federation, Inc.

------------------------------

End of SPACE Digest V13 #581
*******************